Example of a Salary and position negotiation - its a jungle out there !!

#1 C2 or C3
17/09/2010 20:06

newstr
Hi, I had my interview with ACN 3 days back and interview went pretty fine. It looks like I might be offered C2 or C3. I have 6 years of experience in consultancy working for financial services client throughout.
My question is what would the salary range I should expect as an offer . Also when am I eligible for M1 promotion cycle? I wud imagine 2012 Setember ? Please correct me if I am wrong.
Please help :-)
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#2 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 01:29

RustyNail to newstr (#1)
For 6 yrs worth of experience, I would expect to come in as M1 (range: 65k - 70k). If not M1, then you should be looking to hit at least c.60k at the top pay band of C3. Normally, ACN take on experienced hires bringing them in one year below i.e. it takes normally 5 years to reach Manager, so in your case as I mentioned, I'd expect entry to M1, but C3 would be acceptable providing the pay is at the top of that band. If they offer you C2, you'll probably get in the range of 45k to 50k. If I were you, I wouldn't settle with anything less than C3 or you might end up regretting it. Have you tried pushing them for M1?
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#3 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 09:32

acnaspire to RustyNail (#2)
HR has told me that i might be given a C1 in my interview...with 6 years of experience. That is also partly because my current salary is too low (30k) !!!!
i did not push real hard but i told them that c1 would be disappointing and would like them to consider c3,while making a decision (if i am successful). Whatever ACN says is it correct? Do they give a C1 to someone with 6 years exp? Would a C1 ideally get opportunities to lead teams (I am leading a team in my current role)? And the most important question is, I have decided to negotiate after I get the offer to convince them that my experience of 6 years should be considered and a suitable level should be given to me.....just in case they come back with a C1. Do the HR encourage or listen to you OR would the offer not be changed at any cost? My feeling is, they might offer me a C2. Please share your thoughts on this for !!!
Thanks friends.
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#4 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 10:38

acnaspire to RustyNail (#2)
HR has told me that i might be given a C1 in my interview...with 6 years of experience. That is also partly because my current salary is too low (30k) !!!!
i did not push real hard but i told them that c1 would be disappointing and would like them to consider c3,while making a decision (if i am successful). Whatever ACN says is it correct? Do they give a C1 to someone with 6 years exp? Would a C1 ideally get opportunities to lead teams (I am leading a team in my current role)? And the most important question is, I have decided to negotiate after I get the offer to convince them that my experience of 6 years should be considered and a suitable level should be given to me.....just in case they come back with a C1. Do the HR encourage or listen to you OR would the offer not be changed at any cost? My feeling is, they might offer me a C2. Please share your thoughts on this for !!!
Thanks friends.
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#5 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 12:45

wat to do to acnaspire (#4)
if your salary was high they would have offered you a paycut :(
if salary is low it is relevant in determining offer if it is high it is not a factor, that is how it is at ACN
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#6 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 15:12

Aces to wat to do (#5)
Acnaspire,
Many members of this forum have things far easier than many others. Whilst they assume everyone should get ~60k for 7yrs exp there are a lot of companies out there where even an 8yrs experienced person wont command more than 50k.
So back to the real world, as you are currently on 30k, they will probably not go higher than ~48k to 52k but I am sure it is still a HUGE pay rise for you. I was getting slightly more than you and was offered close to 55% pay rise and I was happy to accept it.
If you and I had the chance like so many others to join big firms then yes, we would command well above 70k with 6 yrs exp - but thats not the truth and thats not an option right now.
All the best
Aces
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#7 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 16:16

Aces to Aces (#6)
Correction to last para - If you and I had the chance to join bigger firms much earlier in our careers or right out of college then we too would be on excellent packages today.
Say you dont take this offer - do you have offers from other places that will give you a huge salary increment? The minute you say you get 30k, most companies will not go above 36k - and I'm pretty sure ACN will give you a lot more.
My advice, if your dilemma is just the package and you dont have other offers on the table, is to take the offer, work and see how you fit within ACN and then in a year or two move on if nothing works out. You will surely leave a ACN on your CV and with a much higher base salary to use when bargaining in your next job.
Aces
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#8 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 16:28

AM to Aces (#6)
I wanted a £60k salary out of Acn from a then salary of £45k. At the time I had 6.5 years experience
Was offerred c2 on £50k - refused it. They came running back with a C3 offer £56.5k + £2.5k sign on bonus.
Acn are very keen to recruit at the moment and the extra £10k makes very little difference to them in the long run.
So my advice is:
a) don't listen to Aces - looked like he got lowballed
b) everybody else is recruiting now too so look for fallback options elsewhere
c) claim to Acn that you have another more competitive offer to get them moving
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#9 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 18:45

Aces to AM (#8)
AM, you do need to read my post carefully - asking for 60k when you were getting 45k is fair enough. Accepting an offer for just 50k at C2 when you had 45k was indeed really cheap and they knew it hence gave you £59k in the end.
Though they say they dont, ACN pays very close attention to your previous salary and uses that as a baseline. You got a final rise of just 31% and you were happy. I got a very satisfying raise and I have no regrets in my final decision - to each his own!
For Acnaspire - indeed try your best to bargain for more but in lines with what AM said they are on a HUGE recruitment spree and trust me, there is also a good chance that if you say no, there may be someone else ready to say yes.
Do try your best to get the deal you like - only you know your situation so only you know how much you can bargain with ACN or just walk away and try somewhere else.
All the best
Aces
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#10 RE: C2 or C3
18/09/2010 19:31

joseph to Aces (#9)
The pay is okay if there is no alternative offer.
After 1 or 2 years move up to another organization
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#11 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 09:01

Acnaspire to joseph (#10)
Hi all - Thanks for letting me know. I totally agree with all of you. If I dont agree to this offer and continue, then I am going to continue in my peanut salary and have no scope of improving my salary. But my concern is not about salary because I know ACN is going to pay me better. My real concern is about the level at which I might be offered. I am ok to accept 48k to 50k but if they give me a C3 it would be good. The reason why I got this feeling is because ppl say 7 years experienced in a consulting company would fetch a C3 or a M1. And a C1 in ACN normally is 4 years experienced. This gives me a feeling that ACN has not considered 3 years of my experience isnt it? Is it quite common to join as a C1 or C2 with 6.5 years experience?
Suggestions please friends !!
Thanks
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#12 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 09:06

Dave to Acnaspire (#11)
Golden rule no. 1: Never reveal your salary to a recruiter!!
Man, why do people do that??? Are they half-wits or something?
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#13 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 10:01

Aces to Dave (#12)
Acnaspire - 6yrs should hopefully get you a C3. I doubt they will offer C1 but chances are there for a C2. You can definitely ask for C3 but once again it all boils down to how much risk you can take.
There are many who just rejected offers and walked away and ACN contacted them back to offer what they asked for. There are also cases where ACN withdrew their offer or just said thats the best they can do and dint budge- so keep in mind both sides can do anything.
And Dave-oh-Dave!
Who's talking of recruiters here? When you are in the room in the final round of interviews and discussions with ACN HR, they will ask for details of your current package, benefits etc
You will now say that even ACN cannot ask such details and if they do then you should not provide them with any info - well if you can manage that then great else when ACN HR ask these questions, they get to know your current package.
Aces
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#14 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 11:43

ACN to newstr (#1)
By all means negotiate, I would do the same. In saying that from a company perspective, there is little incentive to give you a promotion and higher salary to move, if you feel you should be an M1, you should have the confidence to demonstrate that and you will be promoted next year. I would be suprised if ACN give you the promotion (i.e. M1) with the higher wage as part of joining - it's typical to bring someone in top end consultant and asked to prove themselves at M1 level?
Joining bonus looks like the way ACN is working outside pay scales. Once promoted to manager the pay would be broadly similar (similar to the figures quoted before)
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#15 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 12:32

Acnaspire to ACN (#14)
Thanks Aces. I hope it comes back fair. I am not very inclined to negotiate abt salary. I am just wanting to enter ACN at a reasonable level....ok to join C2 if thats what they come back with as I am sure i can prove on merit and go up. But I think if they come back with C1, its something like I am being considered as a 3 year experienced person and that would be really disappointing. Hope if the key word I rely on for now ! Thinking positive...and things should hopefully be ok. Cheers mate. I will keep you posted.
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#16 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 12:33

Acnaspire to ACN (#14)
Thanks Aces. I hope it comes back fair. I am not very inclined to negotiate abt salary. I am just wanting to enter ACN at a reasonable level....ok to join C2 if thats what they come back with as I am sure i can prove on merit and go up. But I think if they come back with C1, its something like I am being considered as a 3 year experienced person and that would be really disappointing. Hope if the key word I rely on for now ! Thinking positive...and things should hopefully be ok. Cheers mate. I will keep you posted.
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#17 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 19:52

Aces to Acnaspire (#16)
Chin up - doubt they will go below C2 so dont worry too much. If they do, then prove to them you dont deserve anything less than C3 but will rethink if they give C2
BTW - I was offered C3 with just over 6yrs - my work has been quite extensive and very relevant to the opening ACN had so it worked out. I was pretty sure of M1 but dint rack my head too much coz I'm also confident I can get to M1 within 12 months and so can you!!!
All the best
Aces
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#18 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 19:58

tommys to Aces (#17)
Aces...just wanted to get your opinion..i am a c1 and have been offered a position at barcap 65K+bonus+car..
I am currently deployed to products...do u think this is a wise move?
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#19 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 23:12

anon to tommys (#18)
i'm confused, i didn't think Aces even worked for Acn, so why is he so confidently discussing the inner workings of that company and why are people listening to his opinion?
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#20 RE: C2 or C3
19/09/2010 23:14

tommys to anon (#19)
@anon - what is your opinion in terms of leaving acn and joining barcap...im a c1...
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#21 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 00:30

anon to tommys (#20)
Assuming you are not trolling, you would have to be an M1 to earn that base (so say min. 2 to 3 years from where you are today) and although you would get a car allowance, that isn't the same as getting an actual car. and, without knowing the specifics of barcap's bonus scheme, you wouldn't get anything from acn in terms of a bonus until the year following your promotion to M1 (so at least 3 to 4 years from where you are today).
depends on your future career goals and how they might be met by barcap, but if you are looking for jam today rather than jam tomorrow then the barcap offer is a significant enhancement over what you could get in the next few years if you stay where you are.
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#22 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 08:38

Rufus Doors to anon (#21)
I would not surprise me if Aces is actually from <fortune 500 comapny>HR since all he seems to do is tell others that they should accept the first offer without any complaints!
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#23 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 09:06

Dave to Rufus Doors (#22)
I'd go for "jam today". "Jam tomorrow" never materialises, particularly in consultancy. The whole industry relies upon fooling people into doing things based on the promise of a future reward that they never obtain.
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#24 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 09:53

Aces to Dave (#23)
Dear All,
No matter which company you work for, other than your own, your interests will never be above that of the company and its partners - PERIOD. So stop lecturing and be practical.
I have never spoken of inner workings on ACN - I only said what I know I can do. And I have kept saying that - if things dont work out in ANY company, nothing stops you from walkin out.
I have been made an offer by ACN, I never had the chance to work for a 'decent'' consultancy before and the package offered is more than satisfying for me - This does not mean its applicable to all. I have no issues giving ACN a shot and if they are really that bad, I will walk away. Right now, I want to know how it is to work for them, thats it.
So for heaven's sake, make your own decision and do what you feel like. People keep cribbing they want to come in at a higher level and ACN offers a lower one - fine, then dont join!!!
And if you do join lower but YOU think you are far better than others at that level, then nothing stops you from getting what you deserve in the next appraisal cycle right? Prove yourself and move up and if thats also a problem, then again, DONT JOIN :-)
Jeez - people seem to crib about everything here. Whether its salary or levels or companies or work or consulting - what are you all here on this website anyways?
Aces

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#25 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 11:40

Cyclops to Aces (#24)
So Aces - you have never spoken of the inner workings of Acn. Some of your posts beg to differ..............
a) "You need to account for where those 7yrs were gained. None of the major Consultancies give 2 cents to experience gained outside of the Big4 companies.
So if you have worked in a small/mid firm ACN tends to reduce the experience - this is a fact"
b) "Though they say they dont, ACN pays very close attention to your previous salary and uses that as a baseline"

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#26 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 11:53

Cyclops to Aces (#24)
So Aces - you have never spoken of the inner workings of Acn. Some of your posts beg to differ..............
a) "You need to account for where those 7yrs were gained. None of the major Consultancies give 2 cents to experience gained outside of the Big4 companies.
So if you have worked in a small/mid firm ACN tends to reduce the experience - this is a fact"
b) "Though they say they dont, ACN pays very close attention to your previous salary and uses that as a baseline"

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#27 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 13:11

Aces to Cyclops (#26)
Cyclops, do use your brains for a sec will you?
Both those points are very true - and when I knew I was being interviewed by ACN, I hunted around for info, spoke to few recruiters who I know and quite a few of my friends who are/were part of ACN - all this was BEFORE my interview with them
Further, thanks to THIS forum and its members, I later came to know that it is indeed true - ACN pay close attention to previous packages and they generally tend to reduce experience gained outside of so called Big4 Consultancies when they decide the grade
If you dint know this then you have learnt something today and if you knew this, then what's wrong if I too statd the same before even joining ACN? Public knowledge counts for something right
DUH!
Aces

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#28 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 14:22

Cyclops to Aces (#27)
Aces,
The point is that these are still the inner workings of Acn - which you have based on a combination of factors (an anonymous forum, some of your friends and what Acn HR have told you) and then chosen to exaggerate in your numerous posts on the forum.
Some people believe everything they hear....

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#29 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 14:40

Aces to Cyclops (#28)
Agreed.
This forum is more becoming a ground for other 'consultants' to mock almost every poster here or to just ridicule every single company and the world of Consulting - unfortunately looks like this site is doomed to the fate of so called 'venting out' forums where one can post anything they want.
Im gonna shut my trap and not post any more comments :-)
Thanks for the info and help I got on this forum, it sure gave me an insight into this part of the working professional world
Aces
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#30 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 15:57

Acnaspire to Aces (#29)
Aces - whatever you have posted whether its applicable in my case or for that matter in others case or not - is quite useful to atleast know and read about. Ofcourse if someone takes your point blindly and applies it to their case, they might either get disappointed or happy. Whatever it is, the forum is to get as much comments as possible...as many suggestions and thoughts as possible & the more it is,the more helpful it could be :-) So pls dont go away and pls continue to post your thoughts...
This forum is really excellent, and lets be friends and help eachother as much as possible....
Thanks everyone...and I will keep this link posted on what I hear back from ACN.
Cheers
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#31 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 16:04

Acnaspire to Aces (#29)
Aces - whatever you have posted whether its applicable in my case or for that matter in others case or not - is quite useful to atleast know and read about. Ofcourse if someone takes your point blindly and applies it to their case, they might either get disappointed or happy. Whatever it is, the forum is to get as much comments as possible...as many suggestions and thoughts as possible & the more it is,the more helpful it could be :-) So pls dont go away and pls continue to post your thoughts...
This forum is really excellent, and lets be friends and help eachother as much as possible....
Thanks everyone...and I will keep this link posted on what I hear back from ACN.
Cheers
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#32 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 16:52

Anon to Acnaspire (#30)
World Peace Man!!
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#33 RE: C2 or C3
20/09/2010 16:58

another_anon to Acnaspire (#31)
I read half the thread and got bored so I jump straight to the telling bit.
at some point in the thread someone made a recommendation to play hard ball with ACN to get your way. first this person completely missed the point of the thread [which the ops reiterated several times] - the issue is not the money [you all are consultants; capturing the main issue from a brief is your job for god's sake] it is the level ACN are proposing.
I too was in a similar position where I was offered C3 despite numerous years of management experience in industry. I rejected their offer and I can tell you, there was no negotiating with HR.
no matter how good you are, ACN will not come running back to you just because you play hard ball with them [maybe on money, but little chance on level]
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#34 RE: C2 or C3
21/09/2010 21:19

Aces to another_anon (#33)
A parting note on this thread to Cyclops - if 'real' Consultants with years of experience and vast knowledge believe everything they read then they best stay away from this forum and from Consulting. Moreover, anyone who believes anything they read must go back to school!
The world expects one to have some common sense and if in Consulting then definitely have some knowledge as a professional in this industry :-)
To Acnsaspire - all the best
To another-anon - thanks for reiterating what I tried to convey. ACN dont budge on grades and in your case as well, they have reduced your previous exp and offered a lower C3 level.
Aces
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#35 RE: C2 or C3
21/09/2010 22:01

HE to Aces (#34)
Observing this thread with interest Aces,
When riled, you counter punches don't make much sense. Tending to hook onto one minor point somebody else has made, misinterpret it and conclude that you were right all along.
+ you have not even joined Acn yet, but try to come across as an expert. When you do finally land, I cannot wait for your insights on the laddering / performance assessment cycle at Acn. No doubt, you will conclude that it is completely fair and a perfect example that other firms should follow.
And you always seem to want the last word so cannot wait for your reply!
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#36 RE: C2 or C3
22/09/2010 08:44

Aces to HE (#35)
Thanks HE,
You dont need to join ACN to observe and post what I have - all you need is to know people who work/have worked there and friends applying for roles and securing final offers to get a pretty decent picture of what ACN does when they tend to hire laterals
Regarding ACN's laddering, performance rating - trust me, I have my apprehensions and pretty sure I can get pushed over a smart young kid but all I have with me, right now, is the hope that I can do well once with ACN.
I tend not to think the world is doomed, my life is over, all companies and consultancies are crap - I tend to be an optimist and that generally makes my life a lot more fun with lesser worries - and so far its working out very well for me!!!
Aces
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#37 RE: C2 or C3
23/09/2010 19:57

Acnsaspire to Aces (#36)
No news until now...i have heard that ACN takes atleast 10 days to come back. I had my interview on Wednesday and they told they would come back by Monday but I did not get any response until now. Fingers crossed....hopefully they come back pretty soon ! If the hr indicates what they position they might be offering and what's the money I am looking for, does itby any chance indicate that you are more or less through in the interview?
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#38 RE: C2 or C3
23/09/2010 19:58

Acnsaspire to Acnsaspire (#37)
And the indication by HR was during the interview....
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#39 RE: C2 or C3
23/09/2010 21:49

Aces to Acnsaspire (#38)
They take upto 10days to get back and if they indicated positively during your interview then fingers crossed to hear from them in 5 to 10days.
On this forum itself, some heard in 3/4 days and others in 10 days and even longer. For me personally, I interviewed on a Fri and they got back the next Thursday evening.
At the moment they are recruiting heavily so expect a slight delay - and they usually take 5 days and more so hang in there - it may take longer right now
All the best!
Aces
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#40 RE: C2 or C3
27/09/2010 21:04

Acnaspire to Aces (#39)
Still waiting....its been 6 working days since when I had my interview. Hopefully they would get back to me anytime from now :-)
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#41 RE: C2 or C3
28/09/2010 12:31

Aces to Acnaspire (#40)
6 days is very short actually so just hold on a while longer.
You can always call ACN Recruitment (Im sure you have a contact number) and ask them what's the latest status of your application.
I may off the ball here, but when I had called and asked why it takes time, they mentioned that once you are selected, final approval and decision is made a Hiring Manager who has a lot of decisions to review and approve before individual recruitment personnel officially contact the candidates to inform and negotiate total packages.
Looks like the so called Hiring Manager must be lost under a huge lot of selected profiles at the mo :-)
Aces
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#42 RE: C2 or C3
09/10/2010 15:09

Acnaspire to Aces (#41)
Hi Aces,
I got through in ACN. They offered me a C2 and a decent salary. I think the offer is very much better than what I am getting now...so rather than getting disappointed (though I was initially) - i took the positives and think I would go on with the offer.
I have some queries on the forms that they ask for....would you be able to help pls? I have posted a separate post " <fortune 500 comapny>Admin Form". If you or all other consultants who have filled the form help it would be grt...
Thanks
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Anonymous said…
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